That darn Barry Alllen! He comes back and leaves a mess all over the place!

 

DC relaunches all titles post-Flashpoint

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Now decades later, I wonder what there intent was with that skin color selection. Was he supposed to look middle eastern (maybe from Jordan?) or hispanic? I'm at the point now, that if DC decided to just out-and-out decide that Hal Jordan was a non-white Muslim or hispanic, I would be fine with that. His real name wouldn't make muck sense, but I'd be OK with it.

That's interesting. Of course they could just change his first name to Michael!



Dagwan said:

If you read the comments below the YouTube Green Lantern trailers, a large number of them are by people upset that once again, a minority character has been turned white for a big budget movie.

  


Obviously, it would be hard to suddenly cast Will Smith in the role of Hal Jordan, (Why? Search me!) but the thing is that JLUnlimited had already done the heavy lifting. A huge viewership, who are just now entering that lucrative teenage movie-goer demographic, were already accustomed to GL being non-white.

I see Dwayne McDuffie is the single writer who wrote the most JLU episodes and he produced the majority of the total. I have no doubt he put a lot of effort and work into making the JLA and DC seem less retrogressive for a 21st Century audience. I think that work was very worthwhile. Representation matters, but obviously DC disagrees and decided that McDuffie's work was a waste of time.

 

It's not the character of Jon Stewart I'm championing here, but just making the DCU a place which sends out positive messages to minorities.

 

It's great that superheroes have survived for 75 years and counting, and seem to be going from strength to strength, but a side-effect of that is that we are stuck with representations which are decades out of date!

 

(I can see that just recasting Johns' Hal Jordan as an African-American would have its own problems.  His belligerence, anger and bone-headednes would be read in a completely different light then, wouldn't it?)

 

 

John Stewart.
Oops!  Mixing him up with the comedy guy!
Happens a lot. You're not alone.

Personally, I'd have to say that I have no problem with the DCU as we know it drawing to a close in September.

Is that what's happening? Are characters getting retold or new origins, new villains, etc.? Is there no more Identity Crisis, 52 Earths, etc.? Is there no baggage holding over at all? I can see how that would upset a lot of current readers, but it does make me more interested, at least until they start reverting to old habits. Because, like you, I have no interest in the current DCU, so I can't be less interested.

As to the various GLs, I thought the choices the animated JLU made were really interesting and well done. A young, impulsive Flash was a great counterpoint to the other Leaguers and injected a little comedy relief without making him a total fool (ala Plastic Man).

Whereas John Stewart wasn't so interesting because he was black (although their reasons for selecting him seemed obviously based on that) but because he was such a straight-laced military man. That wasn't always good or bad, just as a looser Flash wasn't. Likewise, an aggressive Hawkwoman was an interesting combination and played well against John.

They actually had personalities, nearly a first for the JLA, unless you count that Hawkman-GA shouting at each other occasionally that passed for characterization. Between JLU and the animated Batman, I was surprised to see how well they seemed to "get" the  characters and make me interested when so many comics writers couldn't do the same thing.

-- MSA. 

The funny thing is that none of us knows for a fact what exactly will happen in September. It could wipe out over 70 years of continuity or just be a blip of narrative "magic". It could elevate DC to new creative and financial heights or be the final nail in the coffin. And all points in between. I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt but I will not go blindly down that path again (and again). My advise, if anyone wants it, is to have an open mind, get what truly interests you, take a few chances and don't be shy about your honest opinions of them. Buy all fifty-two #1s or just one or two, it's in your hands.

As for Will Smith who did play James West, formerly portrayed by Robert Conrad, in Wild, Wild West, in the late 80s was rumored to play Robin in the Batman sequel. I'm not sure if he would be Dick Grayson but it was out there.

Halle Berry starred in Catwoman but not as Selina Kyle, so she played a Catwoman, not the Catwoman! Though Eartha Kitt did portray the Catwoman on the Batman TV series but without the sexual tension of Julie Newmar.

Personally, I'd have to say that I have no problem with the DCU as we know it drawing to a close in September.

Is that what's happening? Are characters getting retold or new origins, new villains, etc.? Is there no more Identity Crisis, 52 Earths, etc.? Is there no baggage holding over at all? I can see how that would upset a lot of current readers, but it does make me more interested, at least until they start reverting to old habits. Because, like you, I have no interest in the current DCU, so I can't be less interested.

We're largely on the same page regarding the reboot, it seems.  I'd love to see a fresh start, so I guess I was speaking more in hope than expectation!

 

I think we will be back to the post COIE set-up where everything is new except the things that the writers want to keep, rather than the post-Infinite Crisis set-up where everything is the same, except the things the writers want to change!

 

It looks like they are sticking with at least the very convoluted, long and tragic histories of Batman and Green Lantern.  Even restarting something like Batwoman means that the new Question will have to feature (which I'm very much in favour of)  But then her origin as a superhero involves stepping into the shoes of the original Question and it happened during Infinite Crisis/52, which pulls in a lot of old baggage.

 

(Actually I am a big fan of Batwoman/The Question, and I'm presuming here that they aren't going to throw out all the good work they did expanding representation with these characters when they reboot everything.  But maybe they will make them both white and straight again, and male, in the case of the Question?)

 

I think the crucial factor in the 'fresh start' is how many people not currently buying superhero comics they can lure into or back to reading these stories, especially digital customers.  That's the big gamble here.  Lots of them and this has a chance.  Otherwise, DC will soon be back to gauging their ever-dwindling, ever-aging fanboy market with gnarly old plotlines going back decades, and as you say, big Events dictated by marketing rather than storytelling considerations.

 

Considering that the last 5-6 years have been all highly hyped reboots and re-adjustments, DC can't really afford to fail this time.  If they do, it will look like DC are the company of constant rebooting and rebranding rather than the company of great heroes and great stories.

It's not pointed out much, but Lex Luthor was definitely African-American in the Superman Diniverse cartoon.  Luthor is big time world famous, so it was a good move!  Also good that his ethnicity didn't matter much in the actual stories they told.

 

Those cartoons did indeed do a lot of things very well.  Increasing diversity isn't about filling some po-faced PC quota, but about enriching the texture of the stories, which the cartoon creators were very aware of, much more so than corporate DC at the moment.

 

Will Smith's character in Independance Day was pretty much 50's Hal Jordan without the ring.

A fast online search turned up Bob Wayne telling retailers (as reported by Rich Johnston) that the new comics are a relaunch, not a reboot: http://www.bleedingcool.com/forums/showthread.php?43450-DC-Relaunch...

I'm thinking that means Superman will still be married and won't have been Superboy, and Batman will probably be Bruce Wayne. And WW will get pants and a new origin, not that anyone will care.

Most likely, the big guns will be exceedingly familiar, and the B- and C-listers will have their backstory monkeyed with for various reasons. But it's hard to tell at this point.

As always, the key is in the execution and how far along the sliding scale they take it as to whether it's worth the hype and renumbering. And that we won't know for quite some time.

I'll be impressed that it's a really significant "relaunch" or whatever they call it if they introduce Ralph & Sue: Private Eyes.

-- MSA

I guess I need a primer on the difference between a reboot and a relaunch. I thought they were the same thing.


A reboot would mean everything starts all over, with all the mistakes and complications wiped out. At least, that's allegedly what happens when I reboot my computer.

A relaunch, I'd guess, means that the boat is sailing off again with the "barnacles," as they like to call them, scraped off. So the basics of has been true for a long time--Bruce Wayne is Batman and Superman is married to Lois Lane--remains intact. But now it's not connected to all that messy stuff we scraped off and jettisoned on the dock, like Identity Crisis, Final Crisis, Darkest Night, etc. And they can dress up some of the ones that have been in dry dock.

How many rats jumped on board as we set sail is yet to be determined...

-- MSA

Let's put it this way:

 

Reboot: Crisis On Infinite Earths -- characters get new continuities, and the adventures going forward are the only ones that "count," unless the creators go out of their way to re-tell some of the old stories in the new context.

 

Relaunch: "One Year Later" -- new creative teams on the titles, but no changes in continuity; the old adventures still "count" for those who are counting.

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