As Thor: The Dark World is set to open, I thought that I would pay tribute to the biggest draw of the Marvel Movie Universe: Tom Hiddleston AKA Loki, God of Mischief! He is the most interesting character they have right now and deserves his own film! Or at least be in every following Marvel film!

Loki first appeared as we know him in JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY #85 (O'62), two issues after Thor's debut. He quickly established himself as Thor's arch-enemy and greatest foe, appearing on more covers of Journey Into Mystery and Thor than any other adversary!

As examples please observe:

JOURNEY INTO MYSTERY #88 (Ja'63)

JIM # 94 (Jl'63)

JIM #108 (S'64)

JIM #116 (My'65)

THOR #234 (Ap'75)

THOR #274 (Au'78)

Of course, Loki showed up a LOT more than that, most notably in Avengers #1 (S'63). But despite the differences between the mythological Loki and the Marvel version, Loki remains the Grand Villain of the Norse Gods/the Aesir. So let's delve into Loki's storied past, shall we? And I have a couple of Thor questions too!

But if it's all the same to you, I'll have that drink now!

Okay let us begin:

  • Loki was always shown being feared and shunned by the Asgardians yet he was still considered a Prince of the Realm. Did he have a palace there? Servants? I mean when he wasn't imprisoned or exiled!
  • And did he possess any real authority there? Or did Odin order everyone not to obey him?
  • Odin, despite sentencing him to all sorts of punishment, did seem to have a blindspot about Loki. He never noticed how jealous, bitter and conniving his creepy looking son was growing. Nor did Thor for that matter. Odin was supposed to be able to predict the future. Did he set his sons against each other so their powers would be honed to maximum effectiveness? Was Loki merely a test for Thor in their father's eyes? Was that why Odin adopted Loki? So someone could challenge Thor?
  • And did Loki really want Odin dead? Or Thor? He craved his father's approval; his acknowledgement that Loki was superior to Thor; that he was worthy and that Odin didn't make a mistake by adopting him. Granted, Loki wasn't a nuanced character until Walt Simonson wrote Thor. He surely was no Doctor Doom or Red Skull in terms of motivation. He was a petty little boy who thought everyone hated him and loved his brother, their father included. He wanted all of Asgard to pay for his pain and anger. But what did he really want? What was his endgame? Did he really want to be the All-Father? I can't see that making him happy!
  • The problem with Loki was how to defeat him on Earth. They tried to make water a weakness or have an anti-radiation chamber contain him. Even Odin yelling at his Opposing Offspring was enough to stop a battle! But he should have been nearly unstoppable on Midgard with his sorcery, shape shifting and teleportation. I guess simply smashing him on the floor a dozen times will suffice!
  • Did Loki ever have any real connection with the Frost Giants as he would have been a prince there as well? Did Loki ever consider himself part of them?
  • Did Loki ever kill anyone? In the Avengers movie, he killed eighty people but in the comics, Odin decreed that no Asgardian could kill a mortal and all the bad guys followed that order! Now that's authority! Making rules that the ruleBREAKERS obey!
  • Is Loki a prisoner of his own story? Is he destined to fail? Can he change? Must Loki always be....the God of Evil? Has he been denied his "Happily Ever After"? And is Odin to blame?

Now a few new Thor queries:

  • Did Thor ever use any non-strength, non storm raising godlike powers? Y'know like make plants grow or heal the sick, that sort of thing.
  • Mjolnir must be really enchanted because Thor threw that thing at mortals and never killed them! Even if the hammer wasn't magical, throwing a hammer that size with super strength at someone's head would be fatal. I guess it has a "stun setting"!
  • I'm surprised that Iron Man never tried to examine Mjolnir. Even if Stark didn't believe in magic or Norse gods, he would have to admit that Thor's hammer was an impressive weapon. Did even the Avengers truly realize how powerful Thor was?

That's all for now! If you have any adopted brothers, please be nice to them!

 

 

 

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I was thinking more along the lines of a binding magic spell, not mind control. If free will was completely gone from Odin's subjects he'd die of boredom.

Philip Portelli said:

Then why doesn't Odin decree that Loki, the Enchantress, the Executioner and the other not-so-noble Asgardians behave themselves? I'm not being snarky but that kind of power borders on mind control. If Odin can make the Asgardians act in a certain way then they should all be acting as he wants them to.

...BTW , I meant to say when the Cmdr. discussed the Trans-Lux MIGHTY HERCULES series , I thought there's be cheap videos out of the T-L series at the time of the Disney series and I never saw none:-(...

  Doesn't much European , from " less secular cultures than we have now " , classical art depict the Greek myths/religious stories ?

  Or , I dunno , is that more in Protestant , not Catholic , European countries ?

Philip Portelli said:

It's more like not opening up a can of worms. The Disney Hercules did create some controversy with the Catholic Church for bringing back the Greco-Roman gods (as if they ever truly went away) to children. Even Hercules the Legendary Journeys downplayed the gods as the series began after the TV movies.
 
Richard Willis said:

Philip Portelli said:

In both Avengers animated series, Thor is described as the Prince of Thunder or an Immortal, never a god.

In the Avengers movie, Robert Downey Jr's Tony Stark is rattling off descriptions of the Avengers and refers to Thor as a demi-god. I believe the term demi-god refers to an individual who has one parent who is mortal and one who is a god, so this isn't a good description of Thor. Besides, we have had numerous movies over the years (and recently) involving the Greek gods. Those movies don't seem to bring out protesters, so why would Thor?

Actually, I've always thought that Odin was the ruler of Asgard because he was the most powerful, even at an advanced age.  He has the power to bend everyone to his will, but it's not a mind control thing at all, it's brute force.  He chooses to be primarily benevolent, but if he wants he can lay the smack down pretty easily, much like he did with Man-Gog.

Additionally, I'm assuming politics of the nine realms keeps him from lowering the boom on the likes of Karnilla and the trolls, at least without provocation.

Philip Portelli said:

Then why doesn't Odin decree that Loki, the Enchantress, the Executioner and the other not-so-noble Asgardians behave themselves? I'm not being snarky but that kind of power borders on mind control. If Odin can make the Asgardians act in a certain way then they should all be acting as he wants them to.

Philip said, It's more like not opening up a can of worms. The Disney Hercules did create some controversy with the Catholic Church for bringing back the Greco-Roman gods (as if they ever truly went away) to children.

I'm surprised to hear that. I went to regular public school and we learned about Greek and Roman mythology and we read The Odyssey and there was certainly no discussion about it. There were also plenty of books about these stories around in the school library and in regular libraries or bookstores. Why suddenly in the 90s?

Andy

  He's a king, they are nobles, mortals are peasants.  When the Enchantress gave Dazzler so much trouble that she ended up in Asguard and she tried to say something Odin said "Silence mortal, this is a talk between gods" or something like that. Vying for power, scheming and plotting and generally being irresponsible in their personal quests for what ever they want is simply their right.

 

Philip Portelli said:

Then why doesn't Odin decree that Loki, the Enchantress, the Executioner and the other not-so-noble Asgardians behave themselves? I'm not being snarky but that kind of power borders on mind control. If Odin can make the Asgardians act in a certain way then they should all be acting as he wants them to.
 
Richard Willis said:

Philip Portelli said:

Did Loki ever kill anyone? In the Avengers movie, he killed eighty people but in the comics, Odin decreed that no Asgardian could kill a mortal and all the bad guys followed that order! Now that's authority! Making rules that the ruleBREAKERS obey!

I think that Odin's decree is binding. His saying that they won't kill mortals doesn't mean they're afraid to do it; it means they aren't capable of doing it just because he says so. I think the same applies to Mjolnir: it's not that it's super-heavy, it can't be lifted by anyone but Thor because Odin said it couldn't.

The classics weren't mentioned when I went to school and the books on myth that I found in the school library were incredibly sanitized.

Andrew Horn said:

Philip said, It's more like not opening up a can of worms. The Disney Hercules did create some controversy with the Catholic Church for bringing back the Greco-Roman gods (as if they ever truly went away) to children.

I'm surprised to hear that. I went to regular public school and we learned about Greek and Roman mythology and we read The Odyssey and there was certainly no discussion about it. There were also plenty of books about these stories around in the school library and in regular libraries or bookstores. Why suddenly in the 90s?

Andy

In the 90s, it wasn't about entertainment or even knowledge. It was about political correctness. Showing, for example, Zeus as being "real" in a children's cartoon might offend someone, despite the fact that he's been around for 3000 years or so! A child might want to read Greek myths and abandon God and become a pagan! You never know! ;-)

Of course, Disney got Hercules' story wrong but that's neither here nor there!

But again that scenario raises the question: If Odin is so powerful that he can't be defeated, why does everyone try to defeat him? Why break his rules if everyone knows that Odin's word is law and he is to be obeyed? What do they hope to achieve?

Randy Jackson said:

Actually, I've always thought that Odin was the ruler of Asgard because he was the most powerful, even at an advanced age.  He has the power to bend everyone to his will, but it's not a mind control thing at all, it's brute force.  He chooses to be primarily benevolent, but if he wants he can lay the smack down pretty easily, much like he did with Man-Gog.

Additionally, I'm assuming politics of the nine realms keeps him from lowering the boom on the likes of Karnilla and the trolls, at least without provocation.

Philip Portelli said:

Then why doesn't Odin decree that Loki, the Enchantress, the Executioner and the other not-so-noble Asgardians behave themselves? I'm not being snarky but that kind of power borders on mind control. If Odin can make the Asgardians act in a certain way then they should all be acting as he wants them to.

I don't think everyone does. There are just certain people who are trying from time to time. He isn't constantly quelling rebellion. But why do people do it? Because they believe they would be better rulers, they want the power, tired of Odin ruling, all sorts of reasons.

Philip Portelli said:

But again that scenario raises the question: If Odin is so powerful that he can't be defeated, why does everyone try to defeat him? Why break his rules if everyone knows that Odin's word is law and he is to be obeyed? What do they hope to achieve?

Randy Jackson said:

Actually, I've always thought that Odin was the ruler of Asgard because he was the most powerful, even at an advanced age.  He has the power to bend everyone to his will, but it's not a mind control thing at all, it's brute force.  He chooses to be primarily benevolent, but if he wants he can lay the smack down pretty easily, much like he did with Man-Gog.

Additionally, I'm assuming politics of the nine realms keeps him from lowering the boom on the likes of Karnilla and the trolls, at least without provocation.

Philip Portelli said:

Then why doesn't Odin decree that Loki, the Enchantress, the Executioner and the other not-so-noble Asgardians behave themselves? I'm not being snarky but that kind of power borders on mind control. If Odin can make the Asgardians act in a certain way then they should all be acting as he wants them to.

Sevalan on Blake's 7 said it best, power is a drug. The more you get the more you want. And the egos of the beings involved will not tolerate someone else being top dog. In Loki's case he feels that it is his right to rule.

Just remembered, wasn't Karnilla captured once and her kingdom over-run?

I wouldn't be surprised if that's happened more than once, but one story in which it happened was the Balder the Brave mini that Walt Simonson did with Sal Buscema while he was doing Thor. Her people were turned into statues.

 

Here's a page on the story.

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