Unless I'm missing it (and, if I am, some moderator-type should feel free to move my comment there), the good folks at Captain Comic's have avoided the firestorm that has hit certain places because Michael B.Jordan has been cast as Johnny Storm in the forthcoming FF film. I'm fine with the choice-- the movies are their own entity-- but I'm annoyed that they've stated Sue and Johnny will not be siblings. I think that decision removes an essential part of the FF's squabbling family dynamic.

Anyone else?

 

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I second that!

ClarkKent_DC said:

Here's a pretty good essay: "The Truth About Superhero Movie Casting"

ClarkKent_DC said:

Here's a pretty good essay: "The Truth About Superhero Movie Casting"

A good one for sure. One point is one I've made before, why should they worry about catering to the few hundred thousand comic book fans when they are trying to attract millions of people worldwide.

Thanks for sharing.

Travis Herrick (Modular Mod) said:

ClarkKent_DC said:

Here's a pretty good essay: "The Truth About Superhero Movie Casting"

A good one for sure. One point is one I've made before, why should they worry about catering to the few hundred thousand comic book fans when they are trying to attract millions of people worldwide.

Thanks for sharing.

You're welcome.

That point is well worth making: The number of comic book fans is small, and the number of Fantastic Four fans is even smaller. No movie maker worth his salt would break his neck to satisfy the smaller constituency and ignore the interests of the bigger one.

Travis Herrick (Modular Mod) said:

One point is one I've made before, why should they worry about catering to the few hundred thousand comic book fans when they are trying to attract millions of people worldwide.

Yet somehow the movie and TV studios think it means something if movie previews and panels are a big hit at comic conventions. They even promote shows with no relationship to comics, science fiction or horror.



Richard Willis said:

Travis Herrick (Modular Mod) said:

One point is one I've made before, why should they worry about catering to the few hundred thousand comic book fans when they are trying to attract millions of people worldwide.

Yet somehow the movie and TV studios think it means something if movie previews and panels are a big hit at comic conventions. They even promote shows with no relationship to comics, science fiction or horror.

 

Moviemakers do want comics fans on their side. They are enthusiastic, can provide positive word of mouth, and lots of repeat business. Still, the greater responsibility is to make an entertaining movie, and comics are comics and movies are movies.

Look at the points raised over here: "Does Hollywood 'Get' Judge Dredd?" Comics fans squawked because Sylvester Stallone played Dredd in some scenes without his helmet. But there's a scene in the first Spider-man movie where The Green Goblin has Spider-Man tied up, and the Goblin is wearing his mask, and poor Willem Dafoe could only emphasize what he was saying by wagging his head around a lot. What works on the page doesn't necessarily work on the screen, and I don't (or no longer) begrudge movie makers for making movies, not comics.

I can understand it from both directions. Hollywood wants millions to see the movies and have come to expect that while comic book writers and artist can only expect a fraction of that number. Hollywood has to change somethings because unless you are doing an animated movie that are things that won't come across on the screen as well as they will in the comic. The Captain Marvel serial comes to mind, during the fight scenes Cap's cape kept getting in the way. On the other hand how far do you go before you are left with nothing but the name?
I believe in character integrity. I believe that if a character behaves a certain way for years then having that character behave differently destroys a part of the character. If you were doing a Jane Ayer movie would you have her kill the mad woman to get the man? It would be dramatic and might look good on screen, but it wouldn't be the character in the book at all.
We've all seen movies that wildly diverge from the comic, so much so that for some it crushes the storyline. I think it was Cap who didn't like the screen version of League of Extraordinary Gentlemen because of the changes made. Did making Mina a vampire make the character more interesting or just more visually exciting? Adding Tom Sawyer gave Sean Connery someone to play off of but they missed the romance between Alan Quatermain and Mina.
The problem is that the comic book creator and fan have one vision of the story and the director and the producer have another vision of the story and if those don't match up the comic book fan might feel slighted. It is unreasonable for the fan to feel that way, and even the fan deep down knows that, but at the same time the fan has hung in there with the character through good and bad times, good and bad stories and price hikes and after all that patience to finally see them on the screen and then get something like Batman and Robin...
It's a bit like a sporting team deciding to raise the price of season tickets because they have had one or more winning seasons. Good for them as they get more money, bad for the season ticket holders who have spent years buying the tickets and supporting the teams through those bad years.

The two ideas aren't irreconcilable. Yes, Hollywood wants to reach a larger base than comic fans, and they'll do what they need to try and reach that larger base.

But, if a property has kept fans for years, there's a decent chance certain core elements helped draw and keep those fans, and those same core elements are the starting point for mass appeal.

As I've stated elsewhere in this thread, I think that the FF's family dynamics are a core part of the FF concept, and, IF they mess with this, they would lose something that drew and kept the comic fans, AND would make them interesting to a larger group of viewers. Johnny Storm's skin and hair colour, IMO, are not core, and can be changed.



Richard Willis said:

Travis Herrick (Modular Mod) said:

One point is one I've made before, why should they worry about catering to the few hundred thousand comic book fans when they are trying to attract millions of people worldwide.

Yet somehow the movie and TV studios think it means something if movie previews and panels are a big hit at comic conventions. They even promote shows with no relationship to comics, science fiction or horror.

It's interesting that No Ordinary Family is used as an example of the "Family as Super-team" that tanked, therefore supporting the theory that the Fantastic Four wouldn't sell "as is", when the fact is, that TV show just missed to boat on too many levels (not the least of which was given the parents physical powers, while the kids only had mental ones).  Meanwhile, The Incredibles, which had a much greater resemblance to the FF was pretty successful, and would seem to indicate that there isn't really anything wrong with the original concept.

Dave Elyea said:

It's interesting that No Ordinary Family is used as an example of the "Family as Super-team" that tanked, therefore supporting the theory that the Fantastic Four wouldn't sell "as is", when the fact is, that TV show just missed to boat on too many levels (not the least of which was given the parents physical powers, while the kids only had mental ones). Meanwhile, The Incredibles, which had a much greater resemblance to the FF was pretty successful, and would seem to indicate that there isn't really anything wrong with the original concept.

I think No Ordinary Family didn't make it because it was poorly executed. It was a one-hour show that seemed like two hours. I could only watch the first two episodes before I gave up on it. Michael Chiklis and Julie Benz are usually very enjoyable, but they couldn't save it. The Incredibles was much more like the FF, but it had a different intended audience.

Yeah, No Ordinary Family was a pretty poor show.  Way too much focus on whining and conflict, and not enough on how they integrated afterwards.

I've heard people say The Incredibles was the best super-hero movie ever made. They can't take that exact family dynamic--especially since that is truly a family dynamic and the FF only approximate one--but it's not a bad template to pick from.

But I think all the FF needs is the "band of brothers" feeling of a closed group that experienced the same event and the dynamic of two adults and two hot-heads. Their relationship to each other isn't that important.

Heck, they could've made it Jonni Storm, Sue's sister. That would've added some spice to those Thing-Torch battles!

-- MSA

There is an on-line petition for producers of Pan, a new take on Peter Pan, to replace Rooney Mara (The Girl With the Dragon Tattoo) who was cast as Tiger Lily, the Indian Princess with a Native American actress. Their response: they were first considering a French or an African-American actress for the part.

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