Fantastic Four

[JD DeLuzio]

Unless I'm missing it (and, if I am, some moderator-type should feel free to move my comment there), the good folks at Captain Comic's have avoided the firestorm that has hit certain places because Michael B.Jordan has been cast as Johnny Storm in the forthcoming FF film. I'm fine with the choice-- the movies are their own entity-- but I'm annoyed that they've stated Sue and Johnny will not be siblings. I think that decision removes an essential part of the FF's squabbling family dynamic.

Anyone else?

 

[John Dunbar]

As I understand it, the number of people who have orange skin is exactly zero.

Is your next argument going to be that people with third degree burns are Native Americans?

[Mark S. Ogilvie]

  In the context of a fictional world where you have orange skin, blue furry skin, shiny metal skin and a whole range of artificial skins I think that the definition of race has to be expanded.

John Dunbar (the mod of maple) said:

As I understand it, the number of people who have orange skin is exactly zero.

Is your next argument going to be that people with third degree burns are Native Americans?

[Rob Staeger (Grodd Mod)]

First off, Orange isn't a race. It's not the New Black, whatever Netflix tells you. Certainly, the Marvel Universe is open to exploring issues of race through science fiction metaphor (hello, X-Men!), but Ben Grimm is a white, Jewish guy, no matter what he looks like, He's not his own race of one.

As for kids of mixed parentage who exhibit traits of different races, John's right about that. There's no genetic need to have Johnny and Sue have different parents in the new FF movie. We don't know if or how the filmmakers will explain it; They'll probably feel the need to, but it's not necessary; it happens all the time. (But since it doesn't happen all the time in the movies, there's a good chance there'll be some explanation in the script.)

[Mr. Silver Age]

I agree it's quite possible, but it's unusual in a movie without some explanation. I can understand the desire to have some diversity while still keeping the family dynamic, and they apparently are related. Maybe they're married?

I don't think they need to be related to have a family dynamic. Going through an event (like cosmic rays) is enough.

The Challengers had that dynamic, and they weren't related.

[Mark S. Ogilvie]

For myself I think I'll stay away, this looks like it's too touchy a subject to talk about.

[Philip Portelli]

It seems to me that it's the film-makers who should be explaining their choice, not us trying to figure it out. I recall that Sue was going to be named something other than "Storm" thus eliminating the family connection.

I get the feeling that the casting was a way to generate buzz and controversy while alienating the hardcore fans who aren't really the target audience anyway.

[John Dunbar]

The Fantastic Four were four ordinary, everyday, regular, normal people who took a rocket into space.  If one of them had orange, blue furry, shiny metal, or artificial skin before going into space, that would not be normal.

One of them being black instead of white would still be normal.  Having the brother and sister be from a mixed race family would be not as common as a brother and sister from a family of the same race, but it is still normal.

Mark S. Ogilvie said:

  In the context of a fictional world where you have orange skin, blue furry skin, shiny metal skin and a whole range of artificial skins I think that the definition of race has to be expanded.

John Dunbar (the mod of maple) said:

As I understand it, the number of people who have orange skin is exactly zero.

Is your next argument going to be that people with third degree burns are Native Americans?

[John Dunbar]

Which choice?  To cast a black actor? Why do they need to explain that?  Or to have a brother and sister be from a mixed race family?  Again, why do they need to explain?

I'd like someone to explain to me why either choice alienates anyone.

Philip Portelli said:

It seems to me that it's the film-makers who should be explaining their choice, not us trying to figure it out. I recall that Sue was going to be named something other than "Storm" thus eliminating the family connection.

I get the feeling that the casting was a way to generate buzz and controversy while alienating the hardcore fans who aren't really the target audience anyway.

[Philip Portelli]

Fans always hate when the movies and TV alter the characters like Wolverine not being short or Doctor Doom engaged to Sue or the Joker being the killer of Batman's parents or Lois married to someone else. This is just another change that baffles the longtime comic book fan. If they intend for their Johnny and Sue NOT to be related, just say so. If they're still brother and sister, fine. Adopted, biological, it doesn't matter, but I've yet to hear anything concrete about it. (Truth be told, I'm not exactly scouring the Internet. It's not that important to me!) Obviously, they're not doing Stan & Jack's Fantastic Four so anything goes. In fact having a biracial Sue is interesting, it certainly beats the usual WASPS that the genre promotes.

Trust me, the day the producers announced Michael B. Jordan would be Johnny Storm, they knew that it would stir up the internet, which it has.

[John Dunbar]

Philip Portelli said:

If they intend for their Johnny and Sue NOT to be related, just say so. If they're still brother and sister, fine. Adopted, biological, it doesn't matter, but I've yet to hear anything concrete about it.

That's just it, there's no indication there's an intention to change how they are related.  This all stems from fandom jumping to that conclusion.  Maybe they'll address it in the film, maybe they won't.  I just don't see why it "needs" to be addressed beforehand.

Obviously, they're not doing Stan & Jack's Fantastic Four so anything goes.

I don't agree with that.  How is it obvious?

Trust me, the day the producers announced Michael B. Jordan would be Johnny Storm, they knew that it would stir up the internet, which it has.

Maybe when he auditioned for the role he did the best job.

[Travis Herrick (Modular Mod)]

Philip said:

Trust me, the day the producers announced Michael B. Jordan would be Johnny Storm, they knew that it would stir up the internet, which it has.

Well you can trust me when I say it is bigger news when casting of a movie doesn't stir up the internet. Seriously,  comicdom is just so predictable.

Obviously, they're not doing Stan & Jack's Fantastic Four so anything goes.

Fine by me.

[Philip Portelli]

If they remade Star Wars and Luke was white and Leia was black, there would be questions. If they remade Thunderbirds and Scott was white and Virgil was Asian, there would be questions. Because they're changing the backstories of the characters. The relationship can stay the same but the family structure would have to be addressed eventually. Would it be pivotal to the movie? Probably not but I'm nosey that way! ;-)

The first two Fantastic Four films were nothing like Stan & Jack's. I doubt that's going to change with this one. But I cold be wrong. We'll see.

I wonder if they casted a white actor as the Falcon in Captain America: The Winter Soldier and said that he was the best person for the part, would everyone be expected to accept that?

 
 
John Dunbar (the mod of maple) said:

Philip Portelli said:

If they intend for their Johnny and Sue NOT to be related, just say so. If they're still brother and sister, fine. Adopted, biological, it doesn't matter, but I've yet to hear anything concrete about it.

That's just it, there's no indication there's an intention to change how they are related.  This all stems from fandom jumping to that conclusion.  Maybe they'll address it in the film, maybe they won't.  I just don't see why it "needs" to be addressed beforehand.

Obviously, they're not doing Stan & Jack's Fantastic Four so anything goes.

I don't agree with that.  How is it obvious?

Trust me, the day the producers announced Michael B. Jordan would be Johnny Storm, they knew that it would stir up the internet, which it has.

Maybe when he auditioned for the role he did the best job.