Two big changes in the DCU (spoilers for Action #900 and Brightest Day)

[Doc Beechler (mod-MD)]

In Action #900, Superman stands with protesters in Iran.  The Iranian government feels that Superman is being directed by the American national security team.  So, to make sure everyone knows that his actions come from his code of morality only and are not forced on him by the US government, Superman renounces his American citizenship at the UN.  Now, this is interesting and can lead to many stories, but I have to ask...how, exactly, was Superman a citizen.  Did he vote?  Did he pay taxes?  Sure Clark does those things and I'm sure Clark isn't renouncing his citizenship.  So this seems to be more symbolic than anything else.  This is Superman saying that he's a citizen of the entire planet, not one country and I can get behind that.  With this and Batman, Inc...the world's finest and becoming truly the WORLD'S finest. 

 

The other big change is the erasing of the Vertigo-DCU line by bringing back both Swamp Thing and John Constantine into the world of Aquaman and Firestorm.  While some Vertigo series will continue to be stand-alone books, this is a big change in policy for DC.  And I welcome it. 

 

I don't want to see Gentleman Ghost in iZombie though...wait...maybe I kinda do.

[The Baron]

Even if it is "in-continuity", it's not as a given "continuity" lasts very long these days.

[Wandering Sensei: Moderator Man]

Well, I finally read the issue of Action Comics today, and I have to say far and away the best part was the story with art by Ryan Sook. Man, that one just broke my heart. And it was what, 6 pages? Something like that, probably 8. Wow.

 

Last night I was at the hospital and held my best friend's newborn baby daughter for two hours, so that may have been a factor in the heart-string factor, but regardless of that, what a great story.

[Eric L. Sofer]

Oh, was Swamp Thing gone?  Who knew.

 

And as for Superman... the last Superman comic I read was "Superman and the Legion of Super-Heroes."  I have not read any of JMS's Superman stories, but I've read about them... and am so unimpressed that I want my time back for those books I DIDN'T read.  "What are you, dense?  Are you Bizarro or something?  Who the hell do you think I am?  I'm the goddamn Superman!"

 

I suffered myself through JMS' Brave and the Bolds... wow, what a steaming collection of dreck.  That is some BAD writing, some BAD characterization, and the product of someone who is... pleasuring himself on the written page and getting people to pay for it.  Hell, I'm still pissed at the JMS 9/11 story in Spider-Man.  THIS IS WHY WE DIDN'T SHOW SUPERHEROES DIRECTLY INVOLVED IN WORLD WAR II.  What a retarded concept.  I suppose now, the next JMS story will have the Human Torch and Toro killing Osama bin-Laden, right?

 

x<]:o){

[Cavaliere (moderator emeritus)]

To be fair, Fogey, it wasn't JMS that introduced the Torch and Toro killing Hitler. The earliest example I know of this was in The Saga of the Original Human Torch by Roy Thomas.

[Wandering Sensei: Moderator Man]

I loved his Brave and the Bold!

 

That is, however, the only writing of his that I've ever enjoyed, which is why I have summarily disregarded the rest of his writing based on the first couple bits of it I read. (One was that book he did for Image that had the meteor that gave all those kids superpowers, and the other one was his first ish of Spider-Man.)

[Wandering Sensei: Moderator Man]

And HOOO-boy! Was I ever wrong--that bit about the "renouncing the citizenship" really does matter when it is so ill-timed! Don't know how DC is going to back out of this one. I did look and they haven't made one entry today on their blog. Can't say I blame them.

 

I'm not saying it was wrong for Superman to renounce his citizenship (ugh, why did he have to use those exact words, though? Idiot.) and become a citizen of the planet (honestly, why not just say he's "expanding" his citizenship!? It's a made-up world! There have to be some made-up rules!), but OUCH is that ever going to smart!

 

I guess he could make himself lose his memory and then have to use a back-up that was stored BEFORE he renounced his citizenship...oh, wait, that's been done already.

[Commander Benson]

Cavaliere said:

To be fair, Fogey, it wasn't JMS that introduced the Torch and Toro killing Hitler. The earliest example I know of this was in The Saga of the Original Human Torch by Roy Thomas.

Roy Thomas can't take the blame for that one, either. It goes to the name-lost-to-antiquity writer of the story "The Return of the Human Torch", from Young Men # 24 (Dec., 1953).  This was the comic which reïntroduced the Torch, the Sub-Mariner, and Captain America for a brief revival in the mid-1950's.

 

"The Return of the Human Torch" includes a sequence in which the Torch explains how he came to be missing following World War II.  These events are shown in flashback, and one panel reveals his final wartime action---the confrontation with Hitler in his bunker and the Torch's immolation of him.

 

 

Hope this helps.

[Eric L. Sofer]

ARE YOU PEOPLE FREAKIN' KIDDING ME???

I know about how the Human Torch killed Hitler, how it was established in the 50s and then re-done.  I know Roy Thomas had a hand in it because he owns WWII, and Marvel needs his permission to cite it (and IIRC, it was mentioned in Giant Sized Invaders #1.)

 

Never mind.  Just move along.  Forget I said anything.  Ignore the stupid looking fat man in the corner.

 

Oh, and Commander, thank you for the great reference as always.  YOU don't have to ignore anything...

 

ELS

[Emerkeith Davyjack]

Commander Benson said:

Cavaliere said:

To be fair, Fogey, it wasn't JMS that introduced the Torch and Toro killing Hitler. The earliest example I know of this was in The Saga of the Original Human Torch by Roy Thomas.

Roy Thomas can't take the blame for that one, either. It goes to the name-lost-to-antiquity writer of the story "The Return of the Human Torch", from Young Men # 24 (Dec., 1953).  This was the comic which reïntroduced the Torch, the Sub-Mariner, and Captain America for a brief revival in the mid-1950's.

 

"The Return of the Human Torch" includes a sequence in which the Torch explains how he came to be missing following World War II.  These events are shown in flashback, and one panel reveals his final wartime action---the confrontation with Hitler in his bunker and the Torch's immolation of him.

 

 

Hope this helps.

 

 

...As the Commander said , it was established in " pre-Modern " times .

  Mightn't the writer have been Stan himself - or at least that he was the editor who approved it ?

  Yes , considering - recent ( Certainly , in a military sense , optimistic for the U. S. A. ! ) events - DC has , I suppose , discovered the power of bad timing , I guess .

  I was going to point this out before - In the 50s and 60s , the United Nations was widely admired , and I can recall more than 1 Silver comic book showing the UN on their cover - Disillusion with the UN has tended to set in , especially among more politically conservative people ( John Bolton/Ronald Reagan , say . ) , and especially especially especially among the " The UN NWO overlords are sending black helicopters to shadow my eyeballs " set...I can't imagine - Can I ??? - a mainstream comic to-day showing the UN on its cover .

  I have thought that it's funny that Marvel persists with keeping the the " Torch killed Hitler " story concept .

  Who , then , killed Eva Braun and the couple children?? , IIRC , that she and Adolph had m, whom IIRC are thought to have comitted suicide with him , that is , in our universe ?

  The Torch wouldn't kill a guilty-of-palying-along with Adolph , I guess , but hardly a camp commander or even Rudolph Ness type like Eva , especially a woman ? Or , children...

[Commander Benson]

Hitler had no children with Eva Braun.  I don't believe he had children at all, but it's a fact he had no children with Braun. 

 

It was just him and her in the bunker.

[Philip Portelli]

Wasn't it Joseph Goebells' children who died in the bunker? They were poisoned, I believe, by their parents. But then Hitler and Braun had poison available, too.

Commander Benson said:

Hitler had no children with Eva Braun.  I don't believe he had children at all, but it's a fact he had no children with Braun. 

 

It was just him and her in the bunker.

[The Baron]

As far as anyone knows, Hitler had no children. the Goebbels' had a brace of kids, all of whom they killed when it looked like the end was near.