I just realized that I've always thought of them as a couple but she premiered solo. And did he meet her or her mother first?
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I just realized that I've always thought of them as a couple but she premiered solo. And did he meet her or her mother first?
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Green Arrow & Black Canary met during the first JLA-JSA team-up (Justice League #21 August 1963), when he was from Earth-1 and she was from Earth-2, but the two of them never really interacted until many years later. That would mean that technically, he met her mother first. Of course, he wound up dating her for a number of years before he found out that she'd been replaced by her own daughter (it's a long, painful story).
So he sort of dated Dinah and her mother at the same time? Creepy.
I could swear I remember a flashback scene to JLA #21-22 where Green Arrow notices Black Canary and says something to Hal or Barry about how attractive she is, but if so it occurred many, many years (and many reboots) after "Crisis on Earth-One/Crisis on Earth-Two" -- and I may be thinking of one of the Justice League cartoons, anyway.
That's not to take anything away from Dave's assessment above. And to flesh his answer out a bit, Green Arrow and Black Canary (the mother) met again in Justice League of America #73-74 (1969) when the JLA and JSA fought Aquarius, and Canary's husband Larry Lance was killed. It was at the end of that adventure that Canary decided to move to Earth-One because of all the painful memories. (Weird, but OK.) However, as later revealed in JLA #219-220, it was the mother who left Earth-Two but it was the daughter that arrived on Earth-One, so technically THAT was when GA and BC first met -- at the end of JLA #74 -- although nobody knew it at the time, even the writer! (You'd think somebody would notice that Canary was suddenly 20 years younger, but let's not bring logic into this.) It was the next issue (JLA #75) that debuted Canary's sonic power (something the mother didn't have), and where Ollie and Dinah became chummy. By issue #79 they were a couple.
4 issues? Fast romance.
I spent a little time digging out the info. I should have waited an hour, as my posting would have been the same as Cap's. I do have a couple of other things to add.
Ironically, immediately before Larry Lance's death, a mind-controlled Dinah was battling Oliver, still in his old costume and old (non)personality. The romance between BC and GA began shortly after she was rescued by GL and GA from yet another mind-controlling bad guy in Green Lantern #78(JUL70). This is when she started traveling with the two guys. I think the romantic bits in JLA were following the GL/GA continuity.
My opinon on the mother/daughter thing is that it isn't continuity until the retcon comes into effect (this should be a general rule for all retcons). So while you can go back and read those earlier stories through the lens of the retcon, that isn't how they were written at the time nor how the readers received them. At the time there was only one Black Canary and no daughter.
Given that retcons warp the entire reality around them, I woulld go further to say that they really create another reality that we can infer exists side by side with the reality that they overwrite. Unless some new writer tells that story, we can only look at the previous continuity stories and do some kind of mental gymnastics to extrapolate the retroactive continuity.
This means that the '70s stories about Oliver Queen and Dinah Drake Lance are about the Earth-Two BC and her romance with the Earth-One GA. 'Nough said.
As far as the age argument goes, it's six of one and half a dozen of the other.
There never was a point at which Oliver stopped being his "Golden Age" self and became his "Silver Age" self--it's again just a retcon and a fan guess to say one run of stories belongs to one reality and another run belongs to a different reality. That line in the sand wasn't made at the time.
And even if you follow the fan logic, you have to guess that there is some other Earth-E Green Arrow--since the Earth-Two Green Arrow left his home time along with the other Seven Soldiers of Victory--while an unidentified Green Arrow continued to have adventures in WORLD'S FINEST and ADVENTURE COMICS (the Shining Knight also continued in ADVENTURE for awhile after his Earth-Two counterpart was supposed to have left the 20th century).
This is all fan wonk retconning--but we should be honest enough with ourselves and each other to admit that this isn't what was in the mind of the writers or the readers of the time.
All of which is my way of saying that Oliver's age was never written in stone back then. Who knows how long he was around on Earth-One? The exact mechanics of time and aging were never nailed down for Earth-One or Earth-Two--and as soon as you think there might be some rules established in one story, there are a number of other stories that pop up to refute whatever rules seem to be in play.
At the same time, Black Canary was a relatively late addition to the JSA and therefore should be younger than most of the charter members of the JSA.
So the age of Dinah or Ollie is a bit fuzzy--as it should be in comics. They're as young or as old as you want them to be. And the whole idea of Dinah being her own daughter was a late fix to a problem that didn't need to be fixed. On top of that, with the Crisis all of this was removed from continuity.
My own feeling about pre- and post- Crisis continuity is that IF continuity was in flux immediately after Crisis, then maybe it was in flux immediately before Crisis, too. The closer you get to the event horizon the more warped and out of kilter the continuity becomes.
Jimm Kelly said:
At the same time, Black Canary was a relatively late addition to the JSA and therefore should be younger than most of the charter members of the JSA.
The JSA had their first meeting in All-Star #3 (WINTER40/41)
Green Arrow was introduced in More Fun #73(NOV41)
Black Canary was introduced in Flash #86 (AUG47)
She is "relatively" younger, though older than me. As I write this I'm watching their latest versions running around on the Arrow TV show.
I know her most from the Birds of Prey series but I have been catching up a bit on her and GA World's Finest tales and I've been enjoying them.
I hear you, brother. I'm at the stage where I identify with Jay Garrick more than Barry Allen or Wally West.
Richard Willis said:
If Dinah ever has a child mother's day is going to be very confusing.
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