We have a wonderful thread, started by Richard Mantle, that examines the Amazing Spider-Man starting with issue #51. I don't know why it took me so long to realize we don't have a thread that covers Spidey's beginning to the point where Richard starts.
Spider-Man is hands down my favorite Marvel hero and I love the early stuff. Peter Parker felt like an outsider in high school. He had girl troubles and money troubles. I think a lot of us could identify with him when we were teenagers; I know I certainly did. Those first 50 issues of Amazing, plus the Annuals and Amazing Fantasy 15, are among the cream of the Silver Age. Outstanding artwork from Steve Ditko and John Romita. Unforgettable dialogue from Stan Lee. A fantastic rogues gallery and a wonderful supporting cast. Just terrific, terrific stuff.
Join me, won't you?
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Curiously, Peter's first day at college was in ASM # 31, publication date December 1965, while Johnny's first day was in FF #50, publication date June 1966, or six months after Peter. Of course, since the chain of events before FF #50 began with issue #44, it could be construed that they began college at the same time. I'm not aware that there was a story showing Johnny actually graduating from high school, as there was with Peter, but it does seem they were meant to be about the same age.
I believe Stan said he did it because people were saying Johnny was too stupid to go to college.
Course nothing really happened except he met Wyatt and they went galaxy hopping. Not much time for school when you're running from dinosaurs trying to stomp on you.
I personally never got the feeling or idea that Peter and Betty knew one another in high school. It always felt like they met one another a the Bugle.
And where was it established that Johnny was 15 when he got his powers? I always assumed 17.
Always had the feeling Peter didn't know anybody except bullies like Flash.
Seems like that was kind of a chance, calling him Barry Allen's name.
Stan rarely ever mentioned any character's specific age, perhaps the only exception being when Janet Van Dyne turned 21 and inherited a fortune, if I recall correctly. The events of FF#1 may have taken place during the summer between Johnny's Junior & Senior years in high school, for which 17 would be the right age and to me it makes a bit more sense than having Johnny be a 15 year old expert on car mechanics and makes it bit less bizarre that Reed would consent to allow him to take part in that first ride into space. Of course, in any modern movie telling, Johnny would have to be well into adulthood with specific skills that make him a necessary member of the crew rather than a hot-rodding juvenile allowed on a cosmic joy ride simply because the guy who designed the rocket and wanted to take it into space had the hots for his sister.
Ronald Morgan said:
I believe the Torch was 17 and Iceman was 16.
After introducing Wyatt, and after meeting up with the Black Panther, Johnny spent most of the next year trying to find a way to get to Crystal and once the Inhumans were freed and Crystal became a regular member of the cast, the aspect of Johnny being a college student was apparently totally forgotten by Lee & Kirby, probably because (a) it would have been too difficult to regularly fit in references to Johnny being at college with all the doings of the rest of the FF cast; (b) doing so would have essentially divided the team into Johnny College Kid and The Terrific Three; and (c) since Crystal had taken up residence at the Baxter Building as Johnny's girlfriend, it would have been rather awkward to have her there while Johnny was living on campus -- Wyatt, after all, was introduced as his roommate.
Ronald Morgan said:
I believe Stan said he did it because people were saying Johnny was too stupid to go to college.
Course nothing really happened except he met Wyatt and they went galaxy hopping. Not much time for school when you're running from dinosaurs trying to stomp on you.
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Great review, John! ASM #16 doesn't quite rate as a classic but a very good yarn nevertheless and linking Spidey with DD, who, after all, was specifically created on orders from Martin Goodman to be a knock off of Spider-Man, just as the X-Men were created as a knock off of the FF. At least Stan managed to keep the knock-offs unique enough that they didn't come off as obvious knock-offs. Oh, and purely coincidental I'm sure that Spider-Man would just happen to pop up in DD's 16th issue.
I first read this one as a reprint though I can't remember where. What I do remember was that Daredevil's costumed was colored all red but with the lines still showing!
John Dunbar said:
If I were cynical, I might be tempted to say that the Amazing Spider-Man series was interrupted to bring readers a 22 page ad for Marel's newest series Daredevil. It's a fun story, though, so I will forgive it, not to mention that Spidey never has to look bad to elevate Daredevil.
According to Mike's Amazing World, this was on sale the same month as Daredevil #3, introducing the Owl and following #2, featuring Spidey villain Electro. I agree that they did a good job. Strange to see the Circus of Crime without Princess Python. I think she was added in their next ASM appearance. The fighting of both heroes was well choreographed.
The only Spidey subplot that advances is that Anna Watson's niece gets a name - whatever became of that Mary Jane chick anyhow?
Good catch! She was first mentioned last issue but no name was mentioned. Stan was probably trying to choose a name, so didn’t rush into it. He obviously didn’t consider her a throw-away character even then.
The sequence with Betty was a bit weak: why did Peter buy a ticket to the circus when he wasn't going to be in the audience? Anyway, he wasn't going to be honest about turning down Betty's invitation to a home cooked meal so it was kind of a cosmic karma that the ticket fell out out of his pocket just as he starts lying to her. Peter and Betty's relationship is not in a good place.
I didn’t catch the point about buying a ticket when he wasn’t planning on being in the audience. Probably Stan should have scripted it differently to match Steve’s artwork. Since Peter was only “maybe” going to show up because his appearance was advertised, it’s hard to understand his turning down a chance to get his aunt together with Betty over a home-cooked meal. More self-sabotage. Daredevil could have handled the Circus of Crime by his lonesome in his own book, but then he wouldn’t have attracted new eyeballs to his book.
But it probably makes more sense that these villains don't call themselves the Circus of Crime out loud - why advertise something like that? That's similar to the early X-Men stories; it would have made more sense that Magneto had called his group the Brotherhood of Mutants and left the word "Evil" out - he truly thought his cause was just, regardless of the means.
It didn’t occur to me as a young Marvel reader, but they shouldn’t have called themselves “Evil,” since their self-image was fighting for mutantkind. (And to rule normal humans)
Fred W. Hill said:
ASM #16 doesn't quite rate as a classic but a very good yarn nevertheless and linking Spidey with DD, who, after all, was specifically created on orders from Martin Goodman to be a knock off of Spider-Man.......
The cover copy and artwork for Daredevil #1 made the characters sound and look like teenagers.
And note that the cover of X-Men #1 included the blurb, "In the Sensational Fantastic Four Style!" With DD #1, Stan upped the ante by including both Spidey & the FF on the cover. DD #1 was supposed to come out in the same month as the X-Men, cover dated September 1963, but came out 7 months later, dated April 1964. Lee's patience must have been put to the test with Everett being so late with the work and having to get assistance from Kirby & Ditko to finally get the completed package out, and perhaps explains why he went a bit overkill on the cover to get fans of Spider-Man and the FF to pick up Marvel's latest offering, and the last of its characters to get his own title prior to the 1968 expansion.