The Massive, Extravagant, Over-the-top Golden Age JSA Re-read

Captain Comics October 27, 2025 at 6:09pm

I've re-read and written through All-Star Comics #6, and now I have a question of my own. I have always heard that Flash was the first chairman of the JSA, replaced by Green Lantern and then Hawkman, who remained chairman until the end. But where is it established that Flash was the first chairman? Unless I overlooked it somehow, it's not in issues #3-6. I see it mentioned in the first issue of America vs. the Justice Society of America, which I happened to be reading the other night, and I'm sure I've seen it elsewhere. But was it ever established in the Golden Age?

Philip Portelli October 27, 2025 at 7:27pm

Going through those issues gives us nothing concrete but there is some evidence to imply it. The Flash is chosen to represent the JSA to the FBI Chief and he makes a lot of speeches.

His is the first solo chapter of #3-5 and the second in #6 (because Johnny Thunder's chapter comes first but he's not a member...yet).

And in #7, they say that Green Lantern is their newly-elected chairman. Why? Because there was a vacancy for that position. And who left in #6? The Flash!

Also, since he got his own solo title, he must have been the most popular JSAer and when you're popular, you get elected to leadership positions. Indeed, Green Lantern only lasted one issue as chairman since he was so popular that he got his own book, too!

Like I said, it's all circumstantial but it's all I could figure out!

Captain Comics October 27, 2025 at 11:33pm

I think your list of clues make it inarguable that Flash was chairman before Green Lantern. I asked because I have now re-read issue #3-6 cover to cover, ads and text material included, and all along I kept expecting some reference to Flash as chairman. Never saw one. And as I got closer to issue #7, I began to wonder if I had overlooked it somewhere.

Captain Comics October 28, 2025 at 11:09am

'DETECTIVE COMICS' #47
Cover date: January 1941
On-sale date: Nov. 29, 1940
Cover: Batman watches Robin swing into some crooks, by Bob Kane, Jerry Robinson and George Roussos

Batman and Robin
Untitled by Bill Finger, Kane, Robinson and Roussos (13 pages)
Where I read it: Batman Archives Vol. 1 (1990)

GCD: "Bruce Wayne's lawyer and wife are making a real mess out of the lives of their children, so the Batman decides to do something about it. He discovers that Midas' daughter's new husband is linked to crooks wanting to steal the family jewels."

Continuing: Spy, Larry Steele, Speed Saunders, Steve Malone, Cliff Crosby, Crimson Avenger, Slam Bradley.

'ADVENTURE COMICS' #58
Cover date: January 1941
On-sale date: Dec. 4, 1940
Cover: Hourman helps a kid in a soapbox derby racer out of traffic, by Bernard Baily

Sandman
Untitled by Gardner Fox, Creig Flessel and Chad Grothkopf (10 pages)
Where I read it: Golden Age Sandman Archives Vol. 1

Sandman and Dian stumble on a scheme to sell U.S. military secrets using deadly orchids. It's a pretty complicated scheme, which I won't even try to summarize. The most interesting part is the mystery of how people are being killed, and it's the orchids. They release osmium tetroxide.

I had to laugh out loud at one part. Dian is driving as they follow some suspects and Sandman tells her to do something obvious. To which she responds, "Huh! You'd think I never worked with you before!" Sassy.

Fun fact: Osmium tetroxide is a real thing, and is really deadly.

The Hour-Man
Untitled by Ken Fitch and Bernard Baily (8 pages)
No reprint, but read online

A train is held up, and for some reason, Tyler's boss thinks Hour-Man's behind it. Shades of The Spectre! But the police think it was inside job and that Bob, brother of Minute Man Burns, is the inside man. The Minute Men call Hour-Man, and he tracks the gang down. Only he is captured (by a tear-gas booby trap in a wall safe, if you can believe it) and is held at gunpoint. He lets the gang confess, including Bob's partner Sam, who is the real inside man, with his belt radio turned on. The kids arrive and put the kibosh on the gang.

Some takeways:

There's a suggestion of foreign (read: German) spies, including the use of a luger, whose owner says, "in my country we train boys to be fierce soldiers!" It'll be about a year before we're at war with Germany, and U.S. comics will start using the name.
Hour-Man is hyphenated throughout.

Minute Men watch:

Three Minute Men are named: Jimmy, Thorndyke and Burns, who never gets a first name and probably won't be seen again.
Thorndyke says, "don't call me Thorndyke," for the first time. I have never read a story which indicates what he'd rather be called. Perhaps in a future story I haven't read yet.
Minute Men is hyphenated again in the story, except in the logo.

"Paul Kirk, Manhunter," is introduced in an untitled, 6-page story by Ed Moore that replaces "Socko Strong." Kirk is a criminal investigator who aids the police, and the first character to be called "Manhunter" in DC history. Created by Ed Moore, he ran in Adventure Comics #58-72, and was then replaced in Adventure Comics #73 by the entirely different Simon & Kirby version, a big-game hunter who becomes a costumed superhero. In this debut story, Kirk (he isn't called Manhunter in the story) catches two killers on a train.

Continuing: Barry O'Neill, Mark Lansing, Federal Men, Cotton Carver.

THE COMPETITION

Amazing-Man Comics #19 (of 26, Centaur)

Big Shot Comics #9 (of 33, Columbia)

Blue Bolt #8 (of 101, Novelty/Premium/Curtis)

Blue Ribbon Comics #8 (of 22, Archie)

Crack Comics #9 (of 62, Quality)

Crackajack Funnies #31 (of 43, Western)

Exciting Comics v3 #1 [#7]-??? (of 69, Pines)

Fantastic Comics #14 (of 23, Fox)

Feature Comics #40 (of 124, Quality)

Four Favorites #3 (of 32)

The Funnies #51 (of 64, Dell)

Hit Comics #7 (of 65, Quality)

Jumbo Comics #23 (of 167, Fiction House)

Jungle Comics #13 (of 163, Fiction House)

Marvel Mystery Comics #15 (of 92, Timely)

Master Comics #10 (of 133, Quality)

Mystery Men Comics #18 (of 31, Fox)

National Comics #7 (of 75, Quality)

Pep Comics #11 (of 136, Archie)

First appearance of Dusty, The Shield’s sidekick. Full name Dustin (Mighty Crusaders #1, 2018) Simmons (New Crusaders #2, 2012) later established. Obviously, Dusty has been continued into the modern age. Final appearance of Press Guardian. Final appearance of Fu Chang.

Planet Comics #10 (of 73, Fiction House)

Popular Comics #59 (of 145, Dell)

Prize Comics #8 (of 68, Prize Comics)

Reg’lar Fellers Heroic Comics #4 (of 15, Eastern)

Shadow Comics #8 (of 101, Street and Smith)

Silver Streak Comics #7 (of 23, Lev Gleason)

Smash Comics #18 (Quality)

Midnight, by Jack Cole, debuts.

Super Comics #32 (of 65, Western)

Target Comics #12 (of 105, Novelty/Premium/Curtis)

Thrilling Comics v4 #3 [#12] (of 80, Pines)

Top Notch Comics #11 (of 27, Archie)

Walt Disney’s Comics and Stories #4 (of 263, Dell)

Weird Comics #10 (of 20, Fox)

Whiz Comics #12 (of 155, Fawcett)

Wings Comics #5 (of 124, Fiction House)

Wonderworld #21 (of 33, Fox)

Zip Comics #10 (of 47, Archie)

Captain Comics October 28, 2025 at 11:58am

To be perfectly honest, I've been waiting for #4 (and beyond). I've already written up my thoughts on All Star #4; I'm just waiting for the discussion to get to that point.

I'm aware that your primary interest is in All-Star Comics, especially later ones that you haven't read or re-read lately. But there are a lot of Sandman, Hourman, Hawkman, Flash, Green Lantern, Spectre, Atom, Dr. Mid-Nite, Mr. Terrific and Wildcat stories I've never read, and this is my chance to do so. There are some I've waited most of my adult life to read, like the Sandman "gap" stories and the second half of Spectre's Golden Age series. I'm not getting any younger, so this is probably my last, best chance. Most of these stories are likely to be crap, but some will introduce new elements to the mythology, like equipment, sidekicks, new costumes and villains. The good news (for you) is that solo strips start getting canceled around 1945 or so. By 1950 they are all gone and I will be re-reading and commenting on nothing BUT All-Star Comics. Hourman will be the first to go, I think; he's the canary in the coal mine.

Like Bob, I'm not wild about "the de facto anthology style of these early stories," either.

It was only All-Star Comics #3 that was a true de facto anthology, in the sense of unrelated stories. With issue #4 the characters still all have solo adventures, but they are tied together by a plot throughline, and in #6 Johnny Thunder appears in a lot in other people's stories. Wartime paper restrictions start cutting into page counts in 1943, resulting in some team-ups, or some characters simply not having stories. All-Star Comics #16 drops to 60 pages, and All-Star Comics #20 drops to 52. This becomes a long, slow slide to 36 pages, as post-war inflation continues the shrinkage, which should force some team-ups. So there will be more interaction in the future, I think, but it's baby steps to get there.

If you want supplement these stories with more recent continuity implants, I'm fine with that ...

So far I've just been referencing later changes in "Fun Facts" and sticking to only what's found in the Golden Age text. But when a modern book simply re-writes a JSA story, as All-Star Squadron #67 did with All-Star Comics #4, it feels like it needs something more than a mention. Some kind of comparison? I dunno. I guess I'll go case by case. And I know I'll miss a bunch!

I also know that America vs. the Justice Society of America is tantamount to a four-issue recap of All-Star Comics #3-57, but I recently re-read the first issue and didn't see much I wanted to mention. Other stuff is just too big; Sandman Mystery Theatre re-writes a number of Golden Age stories but that's 70 issues, an annual and a miniseries -- not something I can pick up and re-read this weekend. And some characters, like Spectre and Doctor Fate, have had so many series and have changed so drastically over time and there's so much material to cover that, like the Trinity, they could overwhelm the thread with sheer quantity. I hope I can get to those titles someday in a separate thread.

I do think I missed the boat on Secret Origins. I should have re-read and commented on each character's post-Crisis origin as they made their Golden Age debut, especially since many of them didn't have any origin story at all in the Golden Age. I'm mulling over a "Secret Origins Week!" to address that error!

... but frankly I'm less interested in the other Golden Age material.

I'm aware, but see above as to why I will continue to re-read those stories. And if I'm re-reading them, I should comment on them, if for no other reason than to create a body of reference work. I'll endeavor to restrain my natural verbosity in future. But re-reading them still takes time, and whether I comment on them or not -- and I'm going to -- it's still going to be a week or two between All-Star Comics posts. I have to work, I have a life with my wife, I'm still doing Comics Guide ... I just can't move any faster than that. Sorry to disappoint.

Jeff of Earth-J > Captain Comics October 28, 2025 at 12:16pm

I'm aware that your primary interest is in All-Star Comics, especially later ones that you haven't read or re-read lately. But there are a lot of Sandman, Hourman, Hawkman, Flash, Green Lantern, Spectre, Atom, Dr. Mid-Nite, Mr. Terrific and Wildcat stories I've never read, and this is my chance to do so.

Hey, man, do what ya gotta do. I wasn't trying to influence the direction of the discussion, just provide some feedback. :)

But when a modern book simply re-writes a JSA story, as All-Star Squadron #67 did with All-Star Comics #4, it feels like it needs something more than a mention.

I have a complete collection of All-Star Squadron, and guess what? I've never even read most of 'em. (A-SS just never connected with me the way The Invaders did.) Most of them I collected as backissues, but I am aware that the series engaged in true "retroactive continuity" in the literal sense of the term as Roy thomas coined it.

I do think I missed the boat on Secret Origins.

I stopped buying the 1986 series regularly fairly early on, buying only issues I had a particular interest in.

I'm aware, but see above as to why I will continue to re-read those stories.

Again, do what ya gotta do. I'm reading them (your posts, not the comics), I just don't have much to say.

Sorry to disappoint.

Not at all. Just providing some feedback.

Captain Comics October 28, 2025 at 5:18pm

Well, heck, feedback I like!

Commander Benson October 28, 2025 at 6:37pm

I've re-read and written through All-Star Comics # 6, and now I have a question of my own. I have always heard that Flash was the first chairman of the JSA, replaced by Green Lantern and then Hawkman, who remained chairman until the end. But where is it established that Flash was the first chairman?

You fellows know I had to look into this, right? Frankly, I'd never given the subject any thought. Cap is correct when he states there is no mention of the Flash's chairmanship in All Star Comics # 3 through 6. Not that I doubted him, but I reviewed those issues myself, on the possibility that fresh eyes might spot something. But, nope. Then I looked at issue # 7, in case there was some mention of the Scarlet Speedster's previous holding of the post. It was there I found the first real indication that the Flash had been the group's first chairman. In the first panel of the first page of the story proper, which I reproduce below.

The caption states: "Since the Flash has become an honorary member, the Green Lantern has been elected as the chairman of the Justice Society . . . " This implies that the Fastest Man Alive had been the first chairman, as his absence from the active roll resulted in the election of a new chairman. But, to be sure, it's not proof positive. It could also mean simply that a new leadership election had been held since the Flash left.

Alas, I was not able to find anything contemporaneous to definitively establish that. Everything else I found came post-Silver Age. On that score, this is what I found, in chronological order . . .

DC Special # 9 (Aug.-Sep., 1977) presents us with, for the first time, the origin of the Justice Society of America. The tale proper makes no mention of the Flash assuming the chairman rôle. However, a two-page text piece (writer uncredited, but presumably by Paul Levitz, author of the origin story) stated, "Flash chaired that first formal meeting [of the Justice Society]." Unfortunately, that doesn't really establish the fact. Mr. Levitz (or whomever) may have been going by the conventional belief when he wrote that, as he doesn't cite any references.

The first in-story acknowledgement of the Crimson Comet being the first chairman that I could find appeared in All-Star Squadron Annual # 3 (1984). An early part of this adventure includes a re-telling of the conclusion of "$1,000,000 for War Orphans", from All Star Comics # 7 (Nov., 1941), when Johnny Thunder's Thunderbolt summons Superman, the Batman, and the Flash to make their contributions to the war orphans' fund. This panel establishes that the Flash was the JSA's first chairman.

This exchange does not appear in the original story.

Next is the same reference that Cap found, in the America Vs. the Justice Society mini-series. Cap relied on the mention in the first issue, but since that came from the bogus Batman diary, I looked for a more objective determination. That came in issue # 2 (Feb., 1985), as seen here in the Flash's testimony to the government committee.

Lastly, All-Star Squadron # 67 (Mar., 1987) is a retelling of the case from All Star Comics # 4 (Apr., 1941). This retold version clearly states that the Flash was the team's first chairman.

This exchange does not appear in the original tale, either.

I might've overlooked something, but it's the best I can do.

Hope it helps.

Captain Comics October 29, 2025 at 1:05pm

Of course it helps! Very thorough as usual, Commander. I've been re-reading some post-Crisis JSA material in support of this thread lately, and have seen some of the chairman references you listed. Strange that it's only implied in the Golden Age, and never stated. Although it must be said that the introductory caption in All-Star Comics #7 doesn't leave much wiggle room for anyone OTHER than Flash to have been the chairman preceding Green Lantern. But it doesn't say he was the first. I guess it took Roy Thomas to do that, unless it's mentioned later in All-Star Comics, when Flash and Green Lantern return to active duty from Honorary status. I'll watch for that.

I'll also watch for any reference to Flash being the first chairman in modern comics, any earlier than All-Star Squadron Annual #3.

Captain Comics October 29, 2025 at 1:05pm

'FLASH COMICS' #14
Cover date: February 1941
On-sale date: Dec. 18, 1940
Cover: The Flash saves war victims from a strafing plane, by Sheldon Moldoff. The U.S. isn't in the war yet, but it's clearly on everyone's minds.

The Flash
Untitled by Gardner Fox and E.E. Hibbard (11 pages)
Where I read it: Golden Age Flash Archives Vol. 1

Workers digging the "intercity tunnel" are endangered by a collapse. Jay Garrick just happens to be nearby, and races down to save the men. By an amazing coincidence, Joan Williams also happens to be in the tunnel, having been separated from her tour group. He saves her, too. Flash visits John Rimal, the guy in charge of the tunnel, who says rival politician Joe Donly is trying to ruin him so that Rimal can't run for mayor. Donly send some thugs to make more accidents happen and then Flash arrives. Donly denies everything, but Flash pretends to leave and listens to Donly invisibly as he puts a hit on Rimal. Flash goes to protect Rimal (invisibly) while, independently, Joan decides to investigate Donly. She finds incriminating ledgers and payroll books and so forth in his desk. But Donly gets the drop on her. Meanwhile, Flash saves Rimal from a hit and takes him back to the tunnel, where they see two of Donly's men leaving. Flash finds a bomb in the tunnel with seconds to go!

OK, he's the Flash, he's got plenty of time. He finds a barrel of water and drops the bomb in. Then all the sandhogs quit because they're afraid of Donly, so Flash finishes the excavation. Then they want their jobs back, because Flash is a danger to their union! (A little '40s humor there, I suspect.) Flash races back to Donly's office just in time to stop him from shooting Joan and disintegrating her in acid. The man don't play! But he's going to jail, and Joan gives Flash a kiss.

Takeaways:

Do I need to mention all the coincidences? I don't know if it's because the stories are too short or if it was just a habit of the times, but coincidences are always thick on the ground. It's also a given at the time that gangsters keep things like payroll ledgers for their illegal gang in their desks. You'd think that sort of thing would be done verbally, or if in ledgers, written in a code, Like in Boardwalk Empire. But no, all these gang bosses keep meticulous records, easily accessible to any superhero girlfriend who wanders by, to be used at their trial. What are they, German?

I'll also mention that Flash saves the tunnel diggers in civvies, but won't give them his name — maybe he's finally learned to protect his secret ID. A little.

Hawkman
Untitled by Gardner Fox and Sheldon Moldoff (9 pages)
Where I read it: Golden Age Hawkman Archives Vol. 1

Once again by chance, Hawkman spots something odd: a red sky over "the valley." (This valley is later named Tall-Wood Valley. In the Silver Age, it will be Hawk Valley.) He spots a strange idol and a crazed cult dance, which he thinks is unimportant. He literally says, "Oh well," and flies home. He should've taken a closer look, because a fellow named Karvac has summoned an elder god named Scorio, which looks exactrly like a really big alligator. Or maybe a crocodile, I never learned the difference. Anyway, Scorio teaches Karza how to make a flame gun that dissolves a person. Oh, those elder gods and their firearms.

Also by chance, Shiera is driving by the valley, and sees the red sky. Investigating, she sees one of Karvac's men disintegrate someone with the new gun. Karvac orders his troops to take the new guns and take on an Army regiment on maneuver nearby, and kills all of them but one man. That man, by happenstance, stumbles near a road where Shiera is driving by. After she hears his story, she calls Carter Hall. He takes a net made of Ninth metal and a mace to check out this new gun.

Hawkman takes out a guard and steals his gun. He wears the Nintn metal net, which protects him from the flame guns (somehow), and wipes out a bunch more of Karvac's crew. He finds Scorio, and uses a flame gun sends him back to the outer realms. Meanwhile, Karvac is trying to kill Shiera and the soldier. His flame gun drives them off a cliff, and they are saved by luck — they land in some trees that break their fall. Karvac comes upon them and is going to kill them, but Hawkman gets the drop on him. He kills him ... oh, wait, no. He lets him go. Because its only page 7 of a 9-page story. He sends Shiera home and the Army guy to the airfield to send bombers. He finds Karvac and gives him a chance to surrender, and when the flame guns don't hurt Hawkman (because of the net) and he wipes out Karvac's guard, Karvac decides to commit suicide by jumping off a cliff. Which is a pretty dumb trick against a man who can fly. Hawkman catches him as the bombers wipe out the last of Karvac's men. Hawkman says he'll turn Karvac over to the Army.

Takeaways:

OK, lots of coincidences in this story ... which is nothing new. And what's up with Hawkman thinking a cult dance isn't worth checking out? Especially since he also spotted a weird idol. I'll also note that the story doesn't explain why the sky turns red. (Blame the Anti-Monitor!) The Ninth metal is a net -- meaning it is not solid, and there's no reason the flames couldn't get to Hawkman. I guess Ninth metal has some sort of force field.

And it's silly to let Karvac go, then to later save him, and later still turn him into the Army while killing all of his cultists. I mean, why kill them, instead of Karvac? He's the guy responsible for the death of an entire regiment! This is all his fault! But he gets a trial, while the deluded cultists all get death. A silly story, but great art and good fun.

Fun facts:

Karvac said Scorio was the Phoenician alligator god. Wiki says we don't know much about Phoenician gods, and the only alligator-related god in that area we know about was the Egyptian Sobek, who had the head of an alligator. Or maybe a crododile. I still don't know the difference.
Karvac and his men dress like something out of "Flash Gordon." Moldoff probably lifted the costumes directly from there.
The Hawkman stamp is the "Asiatic scimitar."

Johnny Thunder
Untitled is by John Wentworth and John Aschmeier (6 pages).
Where I read it: online

Johnny becomes a fireman to stop a firebug who is setting fire to Herman's buildings. Johnny accidentally turns Herman into a goat, and allows Daisy's house to burn down. But he uses Thunderbolt to find the arsonist and the man who hired him. (He also has Thunderbolt restore Herman and the house.) In the course of the story, Daisy and Herman call Johnny a cheapy, a dope, a thick-head and a four-flusher. Other than that, I guess they like him all right.

Thunderbolt watch:

A caption refers to Johnny's "pet thunderbolt."
Johnny refers to his power as "my thunderbolt."
Johnny directly commands Thunderbolt at least twice.
Thunderbolt is depicted as a red lightning bolt.
Nobody claims to see the thunderbolt.

Continuing: Les Watts, Cliff Cornwall, The Whip, The King.

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The Massive, Extravagant, Over-the-top Golden Age JSA Re-read

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