To avoid further hijacking the "Movies I Have Seen Lately" thread, and because there seems to be some interest in men's attire, I've created this discussion to pursue it. (If I'm wrong abut the level of interest, this discussion can die on the vine harmlessly, with no offence to me.)
It's been only in the last five years or so that I've been something of a clothes horse. For nearly thirty years, my day-to-day wear was a uniform. But, when in civilian clothes, I was never one of the "t-shirt, blue jeans, and baseball cap" crowd. I was a bit more upscale than that, but otherwise, I never paid much attention to what I wore. The one exception was in my civilian suits. I'd always admired the look of the suit-dressed man of the 1930's, so, twenty-five years ago, I went to a tailor and showed him a men's wear advertisement from a 1930's magazine and directed him to make me two suits pattered after that. He did, and they fit wonderfully.
Since I retired from the Navy, I've taken more of an interest in my clothing. I frequent the various men's wear blogs on line (The Gentlemen's Gazette, being the best), and I've learnt a great deal about the details of men's clothing. The Good Mrs. Benson always said I should find a hobby, and as it turns out, clothing was it. I started by increasing my casual wear. Contemporary dress trousers pose a problem for me, because the current style is to have them hang from the hips, when trousers should properly come to the waist. Consequently, I went and had a half-dozen pair of dress trousers tailored to fit at my waist, along with adding pleats and cuffs. I was lucky with dress shirts. Van Heusen makes a classic dress shirt that happens to fit me perfectly, so I bought eight of those.
As far as suits, believe it or not, those two suits from twenty-five years ago still fit. (I weigh ten pounds less now than when I had them made.) However, my cargo has, shall we say, shifted in the last quarter-century, so I took them back to a tailor to have them altered to adjust. (He was impressed at how good a condition the suits were in after all this time.) Since then, I've had him tailor a third suit (because I needed a good summerweight suit)---aye, from that same 1930's men's-wear ad which I've kept all these years---and two sport coats.
Then,there were the accessories. I shifted from belts to suspenders. First, because they are more comfortable than a belt. Second, because they give you a straight silhouette, rather than the cinching at the middle created by a belt. There's a learning curve with suspenders, but it doesn't take long to master.
Then, as my pal Jeff pointed out, some sage fellow stated, "A man is never fully dressed without a hat." That presented a bit of a problem, though. It's impossible to really know how you'll look in a given hat until you try it on, and there were no brick-and-mortar haberdasheries near me from which I could select a fedora. There are plenty of sources of good dress fedoras on line. I became versed in the various details and styles of fedoras---snap brim, slouch brim, short brim, crown types, dents, bands, and curls. Still, I ordered and sent back seven or eight possibilities because, once I received them and tried them on, they didn't look quite right. Finally, I found an on-line hatter who was gracious enough to work with me, and I found the perfect fedora for me. Now, I've got two; one in steel-grey (to go with my black and grey suits) and one in brown (to go with my brown suit). I also have a black bowler, American style, from the 1930's that I purchased at a flea market.
I have an eye on another suit, a single-breasted suit (all of my others are double-breasted) with a double-breasted vest. In the 1931 Dracula, the character of Jonathan Harker (David Manners) wore a suit of that type in one scene. I'm putting it on hold for awhile, as I'm having trouble justifying it. My need for a suit doesn't come up all that often. Believe it or not, the Good Mrs. Benson doesn't like to dress to the nine's nearly as much as I do, so my occasions to wear a suit don't arise as often as I'd like. ("If you wear a suit, then I have to get dressed up.")
Now, on to your posts on the subject, over on the "Movies" discussion . . .
Mr. DeLuzio, you indicated that you did not replace your fedora because "The 2000s saw the style usurped by Angry Young Nerds." Sadly, there's truth in that. Your comment reminded me of this image I came across not too long ago . . .
That sort of consequence can be avoided. But, as I indicated, it can take a great deal of effort to obtain a genuine classic look in a fedora, and I don't fault you for just skipping on it.
Flatcaps have their own pinache and work just fine. They're just not for me. Nor is the ubiquitous baseball cap. Oh, I own quite a few Navy baseball caps---I even had one specially made. But they're not for social wear. I wear them when I'm outdoors in situations when work clothing is called for.
Jeff, old buddy, your post leads me to think that you are man after my own heart when it comes to men's wear. I certainly like your style sense. Wearing a bowtie (when not in formal or semi-formal attire) is a bold move these days, and I bet you pull off the look just fine. I like the idea of an ascot. I considered it for myself, but I don't think they would work with my size and build. I do appreciate the way they fit that middle ground between going open collar and wearing a necktie.
I didn't really notice before I turned my attention to clothing, but it's striking how poorly most men dress to-day. And I'm not talking about just on the street, in day-to-day life. Last year, the GMB and I went out to an upscale, five-star restaurant for our anniversary (one of the few occasions when she didn't mind going all out in her appearance). During dinner, I happened to notice the people at a near-by four-top---two couples. The ladies were dressed to the nines. Cocktail dresses, nothing expensive, but certainly stylish; their hair elegantly coiffed. The guys were a different story. One of them wore a plaid flannel shirt and blue jeans; the other was "resplendant" in his blue jeans, "dress" t-shirt, and baseball cap. Both of them had beard stubble; I couldn't tell if they were following the fashion of the time or simply hadn't bothered to shave before going out.
Setting aside all the excuses some men proclaim for not dressing well, I couldn't help but think shouldn't those fellows have shown their ladies the respect of going to as much trouble in their appearances for the occasion as the gals did?
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Commander Benson said:
Comments such as that from U.S. Rep. Peter King ("unserious") reflect the way political discourse has devolved from meaningful criticisms of policy to incessant efforts, no matter how petty, to score points for your side. But with regard to clothing, it often takes three or four days, or maybe a week or two, for photos to surface that show someone on your "side" has done the very thing you complained about. Like President Reagan sometimes wearing a tan suit.
I think wearing the flag lapel pin goes back further, to President Nixon. At least, I remember a Sunday Amazing Spider-Man strip in which he leaves a hotel and walks to his vehicle and notes that the nation is not in a patriotic mood: "I've seen very few flag lapel pins lately." Don't remember when it ran, but I do recall it was drawn -- beautifully, of course -- by John Romita.
Many many moons ago, I lived in upstate New York and one day, when I visited a gas station, on a whim I purchased a flag lapel pin (which I still have to this day) and put it on. When I returned to my office, a co-worker commented, "Look who joined the Young Republicans!"
I was baffled; I thought it was the American flag, not the "Republican" flag.
Commander Benson said:
Jeff of Earth-J said:
Oh, for sure. The bar was set by First Lady Jacqueline Onassis, who was always clad in the finest European fashions. Since then, it's been a thing to note what designer styled the First Lady not just on special occasions such as the inaugural ball(s) or state dinners, but even for less-spectacular moments such as the State of the Union address. The first ladies play into this, too; Michelle Obama made a point of championng little-known designers from the Black community or other ethnic cultures. Dr. Jill Biden wears clothing from American designers (but is unafraid to wear something twice, like the dress she wore at the Democratic National Convention).
Speaking of special moments, for the first state dinner the Obamas hosted, for the prime minister of India, Mrs. Obama wore a dress that, on a scale of 1 to 10, was a 25. President Obama wore a classic black tuxedo. Years later, he noted that Mrs. Obama wore a different gown at each subsequent state dinner, but he got away with wearing the same tux every time.
Speaking of special moments, for the first state dinner the Obamas hosted, for the prime minister of India, Mrs. Obama wore a dress that, on a scale of 1 to 10, was a 25. President Obama wore a classic black tuxedo. Years later, he noted that Mrs. Obama wore a different gown at each subsequent state dinner, but he got away with wearing the same tux every time.
Which is the whole idea of a tuxedo or white tie and tails for men. The reason why there is so little individual distinction permissable for men's tuxedos or white-tie is to lend uniformity. This allows the ladies' gowns to stand out more, showcasing them.
This practise is lost on young men who select their formal or semi-formal wear for their high-school proms. Let's face it: nothing is as risable as a teen-age boy's idea of what looks elegant in semi-formal wear for his prom. The ruffled shirts, cellophane top hats, tailed jackets in a rainbow of colours.
When my son's boys are old enough to start wearing suits and formal wear, I'm going to instruct them on proper attire. I'm not intending them to wear 1930's styles like I do, but I will show them how a suit or tux should be timeless in appearance and how to avoid cringing when they're thirty years old and look at their prom photos. Who knows, maybe there's half a chance that they'll listen to me.
All this talk about tan suits made me want to wear mine yesterday.
Wow! You don't just talk the talk about men's wear, CK; you walk the walk. That's quite a dapper figure you present.
Ladies and gentlemen, this is what I mean about a suit having a timeless appearance. CK's suit displays his individual preferences, but none of them stray too far into the territory which would identify a fashion of a particular era. The ensemble is well put together.
There's no collar gap in the suit coat, and it has nicely structured shoulders. I like the width of the suit coat lapels. Their width appears to be four inches, which falls at the outer edge of moderate. CK's necktie is a bit too broad for my taste, but it matches the width of the coat lapels, so he's spot-on there. The white, pointed pocket square, of course, to add a bit of dash to the suit.
The pointed collar of his dress shirt also adds to that timeless look. He avoids the trendiness of the spread collar. (I have to admit, that would be one area in which I would go a little trendy---per the trends of the 1930's---if I weren't so practical minded. I like the spearpoint collars of men's shirts of that era, but the points have a tendency to ride up after a while, as seen in the photo of Cab Calloway:
. . . so I stay with the more traditional pointed collar, as CK is wearing.)
The drape of CK's suit is perfect, neither too tight, nor too baggy. It's difficult for me to determine the fabric of the suit, but it has texture, giving it some depth when viewed close in. The button stance is perfect. The suit coat appears to be the right length and the quarters are moderately rounded, which I think looks better than quarters too cutaway.
I can't tell, due to where he's holding his phone, but the suit trousers appear to have a decent rise. Because his suit coat is buttoned, I cannot tell if the trousers have pleats, but that's little matter one way or the other. I prefer pleated trousers---and cuffs, like CK is showing. The trouser legs look like they're at full break to me. That's the length I prefer, but CK could get away with a half break and the suit would still look sharp.
My fedora is off to you, sir. Quite an elegant appearance.
This is from around 38 years ago. This was the best-dressed day of my life - I was preparing to take my then girlfriend to her prom. I do not anticipate dressing this well ever again unless something really unexpected happens.
For a youngster of your years, at the time, your semi-formal attire was well chosen and presented a sharp appearance. Sure, there are minor failings, most of which can be attributed to the tux being, I assume, a rental. But they don't stand out, or at least, wouldn't among your peers. You looked elegant without being flashy, and that's the goal.
Thanks! Yeah, it was a rental.
When it comes to hats, I have a bunch. Mostly, baseball caps. There are usually a few in regular rotation. The one I wear the most currently is a Texas Rangers World Series cap, but I'll probably "retire" it once the season ends. I would guess about half the caps I got for free. Including some from a friend of mine that worked in advertising, and he gave me some prototypes that never saw production.
I have a few knitted hats, but it rarely gets cold enough for me to wear them. I have one Miller Lite visor.
Finally, I have a Jughead Hat, which I just learned is called a Whoopee Cap. Neat!
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